Influencer marketing has reached new heights in recent years, with an increase in brand partnerships to reach new audiences. But what makes a social media post resonate with followers? Ellyce Fulmore, influencer, best-selling author, and entrepreneur, joins imPRessions to uncover the key ingredient needed in influencer marketing: authenticity. Today, listeners will learn how to appeal naturally to audiences and what brands can do to ensure they are in partnership with an authentic ally.
imPRessions Season 2 Episode #7 Transcript
Jenn: How’s it going?
Kalli: It is going.
Jenn: So today’s episode is going to be interesting. I know that we have had a few people on that have talked about influencers, influencer marketing, things like that, content creation. But today we’re going to actually talk about authenticity and creating the content. Ellyce Fulmore is an influencer, but she has really broken the mold, especially in the finance industry. New York Times did an amazing write-up on her last year, so she’s going to talk to us a little bit about how people can tap into the authentic side of creating social media content.
Kalli: Amazing. I think that’s so important, and I can’t wait to dive in.
Jenn: Let’s get to it.
The content is key. But what makes good content, especially in a world full of influencers who are paid to tout the latest trends and newest products? The answer? Authenticity. It’s the secret sauce that separates the mediocre from the most popular content that genuinely speaks to an Influencer’s values, beliefs, and passions is naturally more appealing than overly promotional content that can’t be trusted. Ellyce Fulmore, an entrepreneur, personal finance coach, bestselling author of Keeping Finance Personal and Influencer, is joining us today to chat about how she stays true to herself when creating content. Hi, Ellyce; thank you for joining us today.
Ellyce: Hi. Thank you so much for having me. I’m excited to be here.
Jenn: Hi, Ellyce! You have an extensive career working on social media. Can we still say influencer today? I mean, there’s like so many different names that, you know, people call it. The trends are always, you know, evolving. Um, you had a shout-out in New York Times last year, which was fantastic. I’d love to know. First things first before we dive into the conversation. Can you tell us what authenticity means to you personally as a content creator?
Ellyce: Yeah, I think for me, it means that the version of you that you show online is very similar to the way that you move about your everyday life. So if somebody who follows me online met me in person, they would feel like I’m the same person, I’m giving off the same energy and they feel like they kind of know me. I think that’s an important piece, is really just being true to who you are and your personality and the things that you like and the struggles that you’re going through online and not just, you know, showing up as like this perfectly curated aesthetic version of yourself online. I think it’s really important to show that piece of authenticity by letting people in on the things that you’re going through in your life, and that doesn’t mean that you have to show everything, obviously. But I think the key is just staying true to who you are and not creating a different persona for yourself when you’re online.
Kalli: I think that’s such an interesting point. And, you know, part of authenticity is being true to yourself. So when you’re creating a content channel, which obviously, you know, you’re not just talking to your friend, you’re talking to a much wider audience. How do you determine what topics to focus on that not only speak to you, and you know will be true to yourself, but we’ll also engage and excite your target audience?
Ellyce: That’s a great question, and I think that there really isn’t an answer when you’re first starting out. I would say like, start with the things that you enjoy, just personally and kind of create the content that you want to create. But then as you’re putting content out, you start to get feedback from the people that are watching that content, and that can kind of help guide a little bit to find that sweet spot between creating content that you are passionate about and you enjoy, but that also is giving value to your community. I definitely think you want to center the content that you enjoy creating because if you fully give over the say to the people in your community, then you will probably not enjoy it, and you’ll burn out pretty quickly. So I think it’s like this balance between like creating the type of content that lights you up. That’s fun to create, that is relatively seamless or easy for you to create throughout your day. And then also taking into account the feedback from the community that you’re curating and trying to fit pieces in to your content that will help them in whatever they’re kind of struggling with.
So for me personally, I create financial content, and I actually feel like I made a mistake when I first started out because I really put myself into a box, and instead of creating the content that I wanted to create, I was creating content that I thought people wanted. And that really boxed me in at the beginning. And I found that I got really bored of creating that content quickly, and it also just wasn’t authentic to who I was, because I wasn’t sharing things in the way that I wanted to, and I was keeping so much of my personality kind of private and under wraps. And so, yeah, that would be like my piece of advice is start with what you love and then take feedback from other people. But don’t let that feedback become your entire content creation strategy.
Jenn: That’s great advice. And I’m sure to there’s… we’ve talked about this on the show…Anytime you’re dealing with creativity in any regard, there’s always a chance of burnout, too. It takes a lot of energy to really create something, and doing it as a profession on the regular, having to post on various social media channels for different partners and brands, can be quite exhausting. How do you deal with the pressure of that? There’s sometimes volumes of content that you have to create, and you’re on deadline. You want to stay authentic to the brand you’ve created. How do you balance that and the pressure of needing to create content?
Ellyce: Well, I think in the name of authenticity, I will be authentic in this answer and say that I do struggle. And I think a big part of that is I, personally, am neurodivergent and also have other mental health challenges. So I struggle just with managing my day to day life. And so content creation, especially, as you mentioned, it takes a lot of creativity and a lot of energy to create that. And it is something that I struggle with in terms of that pressure. But I think that I’ve really learned to let go of the expectations of what content creation should look like. And I do show up online and tell my community when I’m struggling. So I will literally post an Instagram story saying, I’m very depressed right now, and I can’t get out of bed. So sorry if I don’t respond to your messages. Sorry if I’m a little AWOL, and I kind of let my community into those struggles, and that actually really helps. And I don’t find that the pressure is as great to create consistent content in terms of putting out a piece of content every day. So I let myself kind of let go and really just fall into the kind of cyclical fashion that I tend to operate in. So I will have months or weeks where I’m super productive, and I have a lot of energy, and I will use those times to create as much content as I can. So then that can at least help balance out some of the times where I’m lower energy, or I’m, you know, don’t have a lot of great new ideas. And that’s helped, at least with some of the consistency part of it. But yeah, overall, I think that giving yourself grace for the moments that you don’t feel super motivated is important. There’s this belief in some kind of areas, especially on TikTok, that in order to be a successful content creator, you need to be putting out like 3 to 5 pieces of content a day. And that’s just really not true. And I think if you let your community know what to expect from you. So, for me personally, they know that I struggle with productivity, I struggle with mental health, I struggle with my ADHD. So they don’t have this expectation of me that I’m going to be pumping out content every single day. And that ties in to the authenticity part as well. And I think, yeah, that’s just so much more realistic too. And I think it’s helpful for people to see that.
Kalli: So, Ellyce, I think that’s so brave that you let people in in such a personal way. And, you know, you said before that that was something that you had to kind of come to realize that that was what works for you and being authentic in that way. Does it really make a difference in how your audience is engaging with you?
So I don’t know if I, I don’t think necessarily I guess this is kind of like there’s two thoughts I have of this. There’s still a lot of people that engage with that content that I was creating, where I wouldn’t say that it was necessarily inauthentic. It just wasn’t exactly what I would want to be creating. I was creating for other people instead of like partially for myself as well. But I would still get engagement on it, and people would still enjoy that content. But I think the difference was that I wasn’t attracting the type of community that really aligns with me. And so that’s maybe where the in like the inauthentic piece comes in. And when I do show up authentically and post that content that I really am aligned with, and when I’m really vulnerable online, I do notice that I would say there is probably more engagement and definitely more DMs. I get a lot more private messages of people that will also share their experience and be like, I’m going through the same thing. But even more importantly, I’m attracting the people that really get me and understand me and that I consider kind of like my people and my community. And so I think, yeah, it’s really it’s really important for curating the type of community and energy and safe space that you want to online. It’s key to show up authentically. And I think if you are creating inauthentic content, you could still get engagement, and you might even have inauthentic content that goes viral and does really well. But it’s not necessarily a good thing because it might not be creating the type of community and space that you ultimately want to.
Jenn: Can you maybe give a little bit of an example as to authenticity? And I know you briefly mentioned this early in our conversation, but was there a time when, you know, you were questioning the authenticity of the content that you were working on? And, I don’t know, just give a little bit more detail so that people listening kind of know what to look out for and maybe share some advice on how you moved forward.
Ellyce: Yeah, I think the biggest example would probably be when working on brand deals because a lot of the time, the brands are hiring you to speak to a specific product or to bring about brand awareness. And so they have a certain campaign usually that they’re running, and there’s a very specific goal that they’re trying to achieve through that campaign. And especially when I first started doing brand deals, I didn’t really understand all of the things that I should be asking and like what I should have in the contract and things like that. I would ask for more details about the campaign, and on a surface level, it sounded great. And then we would sign the contract, start moving forward, and then I would realize that they had like very specific video ideas they would have, like the idea with the script and everything. And that was where I felt really inauthentic, because I didn’t have creative control to create the type of video that I know my audience would resonate with. And I’ve learned since then to make sure that I am asking about creative control and that I do have a lot of creative control, and I don’t accept brand deals now where they give me a script to read. But in terms of navigating through that, I think it is definitely difficult when you’ve signed a contract. But I did in those instances, get on a call with the brand and usually my agent as well, and kind of have this open conversation of like, I totally, you know, agree with your campaign direction. I love where you’re going with it. But I think that this language doesn’t feel like me, and I know that my audience is going to know that it’s not coming from my heart. It’s, you know, it’s someone else’s words.
So just having that honest conversation. And typically brands are pretty open to hearing that and trying to work together because they obviously want the campaign to be successful as well. So that’s something to definitely look out for. If you’re a content creator. And I think don’t be afraid to speak up and to tell them, you know what doesn’t feel authentic and what you think, what changes you think would make it more authentic. I think it’s important to come with that piece as well, like do a little brainstorming on what you think could be changed, rather than just showing up and saying, this doesn’t feel like me. Try to have some suggestions of how you could tweak it so that it feels more authentic.
Kalli: That’s so smart. I, in another life, used to work a lot with influencers and, you know, just like what you were saying, we would send scripts and map out a video or post or, you know, whatever the content was, and you’re 100% right. We would have a lot of content creators come back to us and say, hey, can we change this? Can we do this? This will fit better with my audience. I like for us we’re like, yeah, like, that would be great. It’s, you know, we’re trying to create the scripts to help you. But obviously, you know, the influencers and the content creators know their voices and know their audience much better than someone who’s like looking in and saying, okay, well, you’d be a fit. But, you know, obviously they’re not in the weeds with you. But interestingly, I think there are some times when maybe content creators can be a little too authentic. So, you know, when do you draw the line between transparency and TMI?
Ellyce: Yeah, this is an interesting question. I think it definitely there’s a lot of different contexts. I guess there’s a lot of nuance to this question. I think that maybe the problem isn’t necessarily too authentic, but maybe, yeah, more on like the TMI or sharing aspects of their life that could put them in danger, or aspects that are traumatizing to other people to have to consume on, like just when they’re scrolling through Instagram. So I think that it’s important to, I don’t know, kind of have a plan before you go into content creation or obviously, if you’re already a content creator, like if you haven’t done this, taking a moment to really think about what are you comfortable putting on the internet to live basically forever on the internet, to be part of your digital footprint? And what aspects of your life are you not comfortable with? I find that having those boundaries early on is very helpful because if you ever get put in a situation where maybe you didn’t expect where something is potentially up to be exposed, you already have that boundary in place. So an example would be maybe you don’t want to show your partner online. And if you decide that early on, then you don’t find yourself in a situation where maybe a brand reaches out and they want you to do a brand deal, where you show your partner in the video or something like that. So, if you have those boundaries decided ahead of time, it makes it a lot easier to know that kind of limits when you’re creating content. I think another thing to keep in mind is, is the content that you’re putting out going to put your safety or the safety of others around you at risk in any way. So you might be comfortable showing, you know, your home, your neighborhood. Your view from your window, all of these things. But you also have to think about, you know, is this going to put me or my loved ones in danger in any way and being really careful not to share, I guess, certain personal details that might harm you in some way or potentially have, you know, give somebody too many details, like thinking about am I okay with every single person on the internet knowing where I live? That’s kind of like a question to ask yourself. And then I think also where we kind of go over into the TMI zone is maybe when people are talking about their trauma or sensitive topics. Not that you shouldn’t talk about this online, but I think it’s just important to be aware of when you might be basically trauma-dumping online. And in those cases, I don’t necessarily think that you shouldn’t share. I think just the format in which you share should be considered. So this might be something that is better suited for a private community that you have where, you know, the people in that group, like know you and know what you’re about and are in more of a safe space to receive that information. Or maybe it’s like delivering it in a podcast episode where you can properly give trigger warnings and maybe give some context before diving into something. And maybe it’s not well suited for a 32nd TikTok video. So I think that’s also important to keep in mind when you’re putting out sensitive topics is just like, what format is this going to be best received in, and what context do I need to give before diving into this information?
Kalli: I think those are two really great points. And, you know, just going back to the first one, you know, about safety, I know. And as much as we all love our favorite influencer, Kim Kardashian, she actually did put herself, unfortunately, in a dangerous situation because she was always posting her location, you know, where she was, and you know what jewelry and things that she was wearing. And that’s how I think a few years ago, she, you know, someone robbed her in her hotel room because they knew where she was because she posted everything. And they, you know, they went in stealing, you know, specific pieces of jewelry that they knew she had on her. So now I think she doesn’t post everything right away, you know, and change the way she did things because, like you said, literally like it could be anyone in the world looking at, you know, where you are or what you’re wearing, what you have, you know, all those different things. So definitely something to keep in mind and not share too much information. And then also just to what you were saying just now with, you know, sharing in a private group. I’m actually in a lot of Facebook groups for parenting because I’m super cool. But it’s funny that you say like, it’s a safe space and trigger warnings because a lot of times and of course, like a lot of these moms, like, they’re not we’re not influencers, like, we’re just connecting and in a community. But they’ll always say, like, I don’t want to put this on my main page, or like, if you know me, like, please keep scrolling or don’t say anything because this is my safe space, you know, and this is something that I need to talk about that is, you know, a more sensitive topic and very personal. So I think that, you know, having that those places or those trigger warnings, you know, or whatever it is, it really does make a difference.
Ellyce: Yeah. I think something to add to what you just said, too, is there’s kind of a difference, I guess, between showing up authentic and wanting to share a part of your life with your community versus needing to process or work through something. So I think that’s also an important distinction, and it is really important for you to have your own safe spaces where you can talk about your struggles. So whether that’s therapy or like some of the groups you mentioned and just being really aware of, like why am I posting this content? Am I posting this content because I want to help people feel less alone, and I want to share, you know, an experience I went through? Or am I posting this because I, you know, am struggling with it and don’t know how to process it kind of thing. Like, I think just being aware of why you’re posting it. Because sometimes I found in the past, like I have maybe posted some things that I’m going through and it was too early to post it because I was still in the thick of it and still processing that situation. And by posting it, I then suddenly opened up myself to a bunch of like, feedback and criticism and advice and so many things when I didn’t really have the capacity to take that in yet because I was still experiencing it. So I think, yeah, learning how to decipher that and why you’re posting it and like what you’re hoping to get out of posting it is also really important and helpful.
Jenn: Yeah, absolutely. And I’m sure you particularly are approached regularly by partners or potential partners that want to work with you. So what are some of the considerations that you have in place when somebody approaches you to create content for a project? How do you decipher, you know, whether or not you’re going to take on the project or work with the partner, and ultimately just deciding whether or not it’s a good choice for you?
Ellyce: So, the first thing I do is always look at the brand itself. And typically I like to work with brands that I already use and love. So that’s kind of more of an easy yes. But of course, there’s also brands that approach me that I just have never heard of or never had the opportunity to try. And in those cases, I will definitely do my research in terms of, okay, is this product or brand something that I would actually use? Does it make sense with, you know, my life, would my community enjoy this? And I always try to try out the product beforehand before even moving forward with negotiations or anything like that to make sure that I actually do like it. And so I guess that’s kind of on the product level. But then also with the brand, I will always do a nice thorough Google search of the brand and specifically any media that the brand has had recently, because it’s very important to me to work with brands that have values that align with mine. And so if a brand is doing something that is harmful to like any type of marginalized community, there’s likely going to be some sort of footprint for that, whether it’s a news article or I also will search the brand on TikTok. And that, I find, is a lot of times some of the most honest kind of reviews of things. But I’ll make sure that basically they haven’t been doing anything harmful and that. The values that they have. They’re actually living those values and they’re being authentic to what they say their values are as a company. So I do that kind of search to make sure, okay, the product is something I already use or that I would definitely use and like, and the brand is one that aligns with my values. That is kind of what would determine whether I move forward with a conversation. And then another thing that I would consider when once I’m kind of negotiating with the brand is what I mentioned earlier. What does the actual campaign look like? Are they going to give me creative freedom? Do they trust me to make content that is going to make sense for my audience? And that’s another important consideration of whether or not I would work with that brand.
Kalli: That makes a lot of sense. And, you know, as someone who kind of has worked on both sides that, you know, one, you’re part of the PR team that’s creating these negotiations and identifying influencers, but also as someone who looks, you know, follow influencers and looks, you know, for great tips or products and things to try. I really appreciate that you do that, because there’s definitely times where you can tell that someone is just kind of taking that check and couldn’t really care and just reading that script. So thank you for doing that. And then one last question for you. And I know you dove a little bit into it before, but do you have any advice for content creators who are either that they’re just starting out or that there may be feeling a little lost on how to stay real?
Ellyce: Yeah, I would say try to start with content that is just super easy to create with what you’re already doing in your life. So keep it relatively simple, especially at the beginning. And, like, literally just think about your day-to-day right now. Like whether you go to work or you work from home and what you do after work and things you like to do for fun, and think about what type of content you would like to create or share around that. So that way you’re kind of centering who you are from the very beginning. And there’s this exercise; I believe it was the creator, Tess Barclay, that I originally saw this from, but she does this little exercise where she draws, or you can do it on Canva. Put like a little picture of yourself in the middle, and then you kind of write all the things that make you, you around your little person. So you have this kind of fun diagram of what makes up Ellyce. Right. So I would write, you know, that I love coffee and I love doing crosswords and going thrifting. And, you know, my partner is a big part of who I am and my career. And like writing those things and getting as specific as you can with them. And that can kind of help give ideas to in terms of where to start with creating content. If you love reading, think about, okay, can I share the books that I’ve been reading lately? Or do you have a specific platform like Goodreads or story Graph that you love using and would love to talk about, and just kind of approaching it from that point of view, I think is really helpful for staying true to yourself. I also think I would encourage anyone, whether you’re starting out or you’ve created content for a long time, to really be open with your community when you are struggling, and that can be in any way that you feel comfortable. It doesn’t mean that you have to disclose the situation or that you have to disclose details, but I think it is really helpful for all content creators to be working on creating a more authentic and realistic portrayal of what life looks like, because a lot of creators have this perfectly kind of curated lifestyle and this beautiful home, but they never share what’s actually going on behind the scenes. And so I think that creates a lot of comparison online. And then it also really keeps your community at arm’s length because they feel like your life is so far away from theirs and so different from their life. And I think just even letting them in a little bit and saying, hey, I’m having a hard week, like it could be as easy as that and as vague as that. It really just lets people know that, you know, everyone is struggling with different things, and just because they have this perfectly curated kitchen in a video doesn’t mean that their life is amazing and every aspect of it is amazing. So yeah, I would also encourage any new creators to also think about from the beginning, ways that they could be a little bit vulnerable with their community. And when you set that tone from the very start, it makes it so much easier to curate that community that just really embraces who you are and supports who you are and aligns with your values. And that way you have this safe space. From the very beginning. And I had mentioned earlier how I kind of didn’t do that at the beginning. And so I kind of had to change my pivot, my audience a little bit to be like, hey, this is actually who I am. And like, you can stick around if you want. Otherwise, I’m going to kind of find my new people that align with who I am. So, if you’re a new creator, you can do this from the very beginning, and I think it just will help so much with your content creation journey.
Kalli: Thank you so much. That’s great advice and thank you so much for taking the time out of your busy schedule to chat with us today. Everything you shared is so valuable, the insights on the ins and outs of authenticity and the difference it really makes when you’re creating content to our listeners. Don’t forget to tune in every other Wednesday for new episodes wherever you listen to podcasts. And if there’s someone you love to hear us chat with, reach out through social media or email us to connect on a future episode. Until next time.
